Author Topic: Help with paper  (Read 5194 times)

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Newbie

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Help with paper
« on: October 25, 2004 05:57 am CDT »
Ok.. for school I have to write a research paper. I thought it would be interesting to write about and use all the facts on those 911 conspiracy sites, but first I need a thesis. Basically I'm trying to prove that the 911 "terrorist attacks" were not what the media made it out to be, and that Osama Bin Laden really wasn't behind the 911 attacks, the US government was/is.

Could someone please help me come up with a really good/stong thesis statement?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Newbie »

Hollywood

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« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2004 07:50 am CDT »
Well you could go for the closed thesis. For example:

Based on (source), the 9/11 attacks are really not the work of Osama Bin Laden and terrorist groups, but a conspiracy of the US Government because (list reasons).

Or you could just go with something catchy like:

After a careful examination of the attacks of September 11th, it can be concluded that the countless lives lost were not at the hands of terrorists, but rather a mass-murder conspiracy by our own government.

Given more time I could come up with something better, but those are some ideas to build on.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Hollywood »

Lidge Farkley

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« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2004 10:59 am CDT »
No... because this is what I have deduced would be your counter arguement, and being that it is not cemented in conspiracy suspicion I would say you're SOL in getting a solid side to what you want with out relying on the duping of your audience.


*edit to add*
Your paper will need concessions to aide you no matter what you do.  Common ground usually does make a paper more convincing; I say usually because some times the lunacy of a person can make them just plain off the wall anyway.  (this is not to say you are crazy, just a general observation of other papers)
*end of edit*


A counter arguement:
This topic is popping up on many of my message boards, so I have made a GURP (general universal response post) for it:


General picture and info pages (may be news sources, may be conspiracy theory sites which are disproovable).  These are my sources for the images only in the following layout:
http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/pentagon/pe ... 20316.html
http://www.thepowerhour.com/911_analysis/report.htm
http://www.utopiax.org/aa77.html

This picture clearly illustrates the side of the building at 921 feet in a conceptual layout of the building:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/dayart/20 ... Damage.pdf
(in addition to the above sites)


Considering the size and height of the building, I would say that the pentagon crash photos (which show the plane hitting the building) accurately depict the "small object" at the correct height for such a plane to be hitting a 4 story + roofed building.  Of course it will look small in comparisson to the building, but it is at the far side of the camera range, and in comparrison to the perspective of the height of the building, it makes sense for it to be the size that it is in the impact photos.
These links show the photos:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1861977.stm

(http://www.utopiax.org/aa77.html)
This one shows an overhead perspective as well, with the approximate plane size overlayed, showing clearly the impact edges:

(http://www.conceptual.net.au/~jackc/pentagon.htm)


If it still looks like a "small object" after considering the perspective, your mind is playing a trick on you, and this is easy as our minds are set up to play this trick on us... which is why perspective was not discovered until the Renaissance (at which point some kind of primitive projector was built [some kind of camera name I forget the name of] which an imaged was traced from and perspective was realised.):
The Vanishing Point of the security photos will reveal that the plane is actually as large as depicted in real life.  Run the lines of the pentagon inward toward the horizon, strait lines, and where they intersect is your vanishing point.  Make a note of the distances of the top and bottom edges of the pentagon on the left and then mark those same distances on the right of the page, equidistant from the vanishing point as the two spots where the pentagon runs off the page (you can mark these off the page as well, just don't move the paper until after you're finished with these steps.)  Now draw perspective lines in from those lines to the vanishing point established orriginally by the pentagon lines.
Compare the size of the plane in perspective.  It's the right size.
(we are reviewing perspective in my drawing class right now)



To tackle the Plane crash photos of "fuel burn marks on the grass" that can be explained as well:
This one can be used to align perspective for the extent of fireball out towards the grass.  Use the same method as before, but only for the left side.  Use the street corner with the white post on it as your perspective line into to the vanishing point established by the pentagon lines:

(additionally the above photo does show fuel burning upwards and outwards at the maximum known range for the fuel to have reached in fireball size.  Fire burns up, therefore the fireball would not burn the grass unless it had a level proximity [or contact] to the lawn itself.  This picture depicts the fireball a few feet above the lawn [perspective line again], thus making it possible for the lawn to have survived the initial impact fire ball with out getting any singe other than the immediate front edge depicted in the next image.)

This one shows some of the burn area in front of the pentagon.

(only the bottom edge is visible, and it is where the fireball is known to have touched the ground, as in the largest fireball photo.)
This one shows a larger overhead view of the above, with the edge intact:

...and this with the point of perspective white street post corner mentioned earlier (though the post is just outside of the photo [I think] you can easily see the same street corner the post is on in the security photos):

(look at the edge of the street in front and compare it to the perspective line that we can establish from the street corner in the upper left view that would be parallel to the front of the pentagon in this view.)


If this analysis, which I just wrote up myself using pictures used in the same sites as the conspiracy sites, does not satisfy the misconception then post what makes no sense and I might later attempt to help more with clarification.

I have also seen a compelling debunking, although it still has some holes, by the snopes.com urban legend site which influenced the above (and below) in no way:
http://www.snopes.com/rumors/pentagon.htm

Addition:
I was asked about the hole punch size into the pentagon. If you can remember, they initially thought (in news rooms) that the first plane was a private plane because the hole was so small. Refer to the final link I gave. It describes the reinforced materials the wall had been made out of. Of course the WTC was reinforced as well, but not nearly as thick, and the entry holes of the WTC looked very small as well, centrally around the fueselage area.

Addition:
I was asked about my proclaimation that the jet fuel would not cause the lawn to have a large scortch mark, due to it's height above and non-contact with the grass. I spent many hours of my youth testing, burning, and experimenting with accelerants (safely, only in a large tilled field, for safety) to see their effects both on their environments and on the materials they were inside of or were touched by. This includes copper, aluminum, glass, plactic, grass, wood, Diesel, DNA, (other various alcohols), Gasoline, Propellants, etc.
Crashes of flights in fields may illustrate this point better than my claims to have been an experimental (but safe) pyromaniac. Just as the above, the following were taken from some type of news source or conspiracy site, links in the pictures:
The Concorde Crash:

(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/851119.stm)
This is the only field crash in color picture I could find in 2 hours of searching and it illustrates the physics of jetfuel in a severe crash.
The grass right next to the burn mark is still green and unmarked.


That is all I can say about the Penta-Lawn.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Lidge Farkley »
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Hollywood

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« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2004 02:41 pm CDT »
He just asked for a thesis  :wink:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Hollywood »

Hersh

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« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2004 05:48 pm CDT »
Researched material confirms that the September Eleventh attack on America was an orchestrated display guided by the American government to ... (do whatever you think was the purpose.)

--Sorry, its hard to do good work when its not my grade thats at stake. "guided" is the only word I dont't like though, maybe "handled"
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Hersh »

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nesso

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« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2004 01:50 am CDT »
hey look Lidge Farkley just did my next project!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by nesso »

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« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2004 05:02 am CDT »
Quote from: "Hersh"
Researched material confirms that the September Eleventh attack on America was an orchestrated display guided by the American government to ... (do whatever you think was the purpose.)

--Sorry, its hard to do good work when its not my grade thats at stake. "guided" is the only word I dont't like though, maybe "handled"


I think the word "executed" would make a good substitute..

Thanks guys this really helped alot.. it spawned some alot of ideas too. I ended up using something like Hollywood's second thesis.  :)

Oh yeah Nesso, I don't think anyone would believe for a minute that you could make such a intelligent response such as Lidge did..  You get an F for plagiarism ^_^
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Newbie »

nesso

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« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2004 04:09 pm CDT »
i know i'll get caught, fork turnitin.com

Our school signed up for this crap[/url]
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by nesso »

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Lidge Farkley

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« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2004 04:56 pm CDT »
Er... yeah sorry about the heafty post on my part.

I was trying to pose the other side from a different angle to help you out with a concession arguement for part of the body of the paper.. which I see you didn't ask for.
:-)

Hope you do well; peace!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Lidge Farkley »
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Kendril

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« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2004 05:16 pm CDT »
Well your paper is going to get shot down with a ton of holes since on October 29th,2004 Osama Binladen Publicly announced that he was responsible for the terroist attcks on the world trade Center Buildings. Now I guess you guys need to find a new conspiracy to go after. Good Luck
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Kendril »

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Hersh

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« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2004 05:34 pm CDT »
Teh government forced him to do it. (They put a mind control chip in his tooth!)
   :shock:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Hersh »

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Frantic

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« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2004 05:51 pm CDT »
Wheres my tinfoil hat?!?!?!!?!?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Frantic »

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« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2004 08:33 am CDT »
It's simply a tape.. how do you know for sure that that it's Osama Bin Laden?

All it is, is propaganda for the election, you think it's coincidence it was released four days before election day?

I also find it kind of odd that right as the real story behind 911 is becoming more and more popularly known, this tape shows up on the air..  :roll:

Sounds like the CIA's desperate attempt to keep faith in the American people and shoot down the real story.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Newbie »

Kendril

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« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2004 10:55 am CDT »
Quote from: "Newbie"
It's simply a tape.. how do you know for sure that that it's Osama Bin Laden?

All it is, is propaganda for the election, you think it's coincidence it was released four days before election day?

I also find it kind of odd that right as the real story behind 911 is becoming more and more popularly known, this tape shows up on the air..  :lol:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Kendril »

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remote-control

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« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2004 11:10 am CDT »
Just be sure that when you write your thesis, YOU MUST HAVE RATIONALE!!! If you're stating a fact, that's a BIG NO NO! It has to be rationale, thats the one thing my college professor stresses to us. Good luck newbie with your paper! I'm just thankful that in high school I never had to write a research paper  :D !
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by remote-control »