Author Topic: $25 Million Prize for fixing climate  (Read 10323 times)

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Bovidi

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« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2007 11:51 am CST »
Quote from: "villman420"
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1363818.ece

read that then tell me what you hippy earth lovers have to say


Does anyone actually believe that article?  Some of the things said in there were pretty reasonable to the eye but the fact is they still "disproved" some of the facts in the report by using unreasonable logic.

Fact is prior reports have proven that the world is warming, most likely because of humans.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Bovidi »

Kyrie

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« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2007 01:23 pm CST »
Most recent Global Warming study:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPCC_Fourt ... ent_Report

Quote
It concludes that warming of the climate system is unequivocal, and that it is very likely (probability is more than 90%) that most of the warming observed since the mid-20th century is caused by human emissions of greenhouse gases.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Kyrie »







KoRo

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« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2007 10:05 pm CST »
Articles/studies notwithstanding, the fact is that over the eons, the Earth's ecosystem has balanced out the carbon-oxygen ratio via natural processes...

When there's too little carbon and the Earth is cold, volcanism and slower plant metabolism raises the caron level.
When there's too much carbon, rain and plants/algae would suck up that carbon.

Back in the prehistoric age, the excess carbon that was present after the K-T event (due to decomposing dinosaurs) was sealed underground until humans tapped it for fuel. Since then, all the excess carbon that was naturally kept underground has been released into the air, thus upsetting the natural balance. There's no denying that much, no matter how you look at it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by KoRo »

RedneckNoob

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« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2007 10:26 pm CST »
There's no denying the fact that 90% of the Carbon in the atmosphere is released from Volcanos.  There's also no denying the fact that 91.37% of "greenhouse gases" is water vapor.  You also can't tell me that somehow that Carbon from Earth is causing the ice caps on Mars to melt as well.  If global warming is happening, why is Mars getting warmer?  Global warming isn't happening.  If anything the sun itself may be getting hotter.  I also saw nothing in that link that disproves itself what so ever.  Please be more specific if you are going to state that.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by RedneckNoob »





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Kyrie

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« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2007 12:37 am CST »
Quote
Carbon dioxide is the most important anthropogenic greenhouse gas (see Figure SPM-2). The global atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide has increased from a pre-industrial value of about 280 ppm to 379 ppm3 in 2005. The atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide in 2005 exceeds by far the natural range over the last 650,000 years (180 to 300 ppm) as determined from ice cores. The annual carbon dioxide concentration growth-rate was larger during the last 10 years (1995 – 2005 average: 1.9 ppm per year), than it has been since the beginning of continuous direct atmospheric measurements (1960 – 2005 average: 1.4 ppm per year) although there is year-to-year variability in growth rates. {2.3, 7.3}

While it's true that volcanoes release large amounts of carbon dioxide, how would you use that to argue the increasing levels? Are there increasingly more and more volcanic eruptions releasing these gases? I haven't heard of increased volcanic activity.
Would you please post some links to back up your statements that can't be denied? I've never once heard that water is 91.37% of all "greenhouse gas." I have read, though, that up to 70% of the Green House effect is caused by water. That's not really what's in debate. What's in debate is whether or not the increase of green house gases that we have control over, have increased beyond what would be considered normal levels and does that increase contribute to the overall rise in temperatures. The largest of these gases that we have control over is carbon dioxide which accounts for up to 26% of the green house effect.

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Also the fact that every UN report leaves out the Midevil Warming Period.
I think you need to recheck your sources (and/or post what they are). The 2001 IPCC (that's the UN group) did study that period as well as the "Little Ice Age" and concluded that it was a local change, not a global change. (http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/070.htm)

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Not to mention the fact that statistics say that in the past 20 years, the average temperature of the Earth has decreased by 0.1 degrees centigrade.
Again...source? I don't see a decrease in temperature over the last 20 years here: ftp://ftp.ncdc.noaa.gov/pub/data/anomal ... 00mean.dat

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ou also can't tell me that somehow that Carbon from Earth is causing the ice caps on Mars to melt as well. If global warming is happening, why is Mars getting warmer?

I'd like to see some...well, you know.
Here: http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2003 ... thpole.htm
The title of that article is "Mars is Melting." Too bad they're just using it for shock appeal, or something. The polar ice cap may be shrinking, but if you'd take a look at the other ice cap, I think you'd find that it's growing. Mars has seasons, too, you know. Summer in the Northern hemisphere generally leads to winter in the Southern hemisphere.

Here's a link that kind of supports your 'Sun is getting hotter' reasoning. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... wstop.html
Unfortunatly, it also kind of shoots down your 'average temperature of the Earth has decreased by 0.1 degrees centigrade' proof. Right near the top, too. :x
And here's another which concludes that the sun's effect on global warming is minimal:
http://www.terradaily.com/reports/Chang ... g_999.html
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Kyrie »







Bovidi

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« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2007 03:36 pm CST »
Quote from: "KoRo"
Articles/studies notwithstanding, the fact is that over the eons, the Earth's ecosystem has balanced out the carbon-oxygen ratio via natural processes...

When there's too little carbon and the Earth is cold, volcanism and slower plant metabolism raises the caron level.
When there's too much carbon, rain and plants/algae would suck up that carbon.


Only problem about the natural process is that when the Earth got cold, yea some volcanoes did help to create the Earth warm again but the fact is if there is too much carbon there isn't enough plantlife that can suck up the amount of carbon humans produce.  Also don't forget that we are destroying all of our rainforests.  Finally I would like to point out most of the time that there has been this global cooling or heating there were extinctions.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Bovidi »

KoRo

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« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2007 09:33 pm CST »
Quote from: "Bovidi"
Only problem about the natural process is that when the Earth got cold, yea some volcanoes did help to create the Earth warm again but the fact is if there is too much carbon there isn't enough plantlife that can suck up the amount of carbon humans produce.  Also don't forget that we are destroying all of our rainforests.  Finally I would like to point out most of the time that there has been this global cooling or heating there were extinctions.
That only adds to my point. We are indeed actively helping to destroy our environment. I was trying to say that before humans came along, there was a balance, but we've disrupted that balance.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by KoRo »

Vorter_X_

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« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2007 09:42 pm CST »
Who cares? We will all be dead long before anything seriously bad happens...Unless something passes to destroy every tree in the world...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Vorter_X_ »

KoRo

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« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2007 09:57 pm CST »
I think that's exactly why the environment is going the way of the dinosaur...

Change on this grand of a scale surpasses the timespan of one generation. If we're going to do anything epic to fix our problems, we've got to see past our own lives.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by KoRo »

Artorius

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« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2007 11:27 pm CST »
Dinosaurs? Everyone knows that's Anti-Christian propaganda, spread by Atheists/Intelligent people/Satan/Liberals.

This has nothing to do with pollution, It's obviously god preparing the earth for the rapture.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Artorius »


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Kyrie

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« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2007 11:46 pm CST »
Quote from: "Artorius"
This has nothing to do with pollution, It's obviously god preparing the earth for the rapture.


I agree because I like your avatar.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Kyrie »







Vorter_X_

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« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2007 09:54 am CST »
<----Atheist...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by Vorter_X_ »

RedneckNoob

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« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2007 06:48 pm CST »
Since Kyrie wants citations, I'll start showing my citations.
http://http://boortz.com/nuze/200702/02022007.html

One major thing I'd like to point your attention to from that link is:
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What happened to the Medieval Warm Period? In 1996 the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change issued a chart showing climatic change over a period of 1000 years. This graph showed a Medieval warming period in which global temperatures were higher than they are today. In 2001 the IPCC issued another 1000 year graph in which the Medieval warming period was missing. Why?

Any rebuttle on that?  Even more:
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Why has one scientist promoting the cause of man-made global warming been quoted as saying "we have to get rid of the medieval warming period?"

Wow, now that's interesting.  Severly interesting.  Now I wonder what other type of liberal propaganda we're going to see next.
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There are about 160,000 glaciers around the world. Most have never been visited or measured by man. The great majority of these glaciers are growing, not melting.

Hmm.  I wonder.  Now, using pure analytics, I've got a question for you.  If the ice caps are "melting" then how can these ice cores display layers that show the effects of CO2 levels?

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Why did a reporter from National Public Radio refuse to interview David Deming, an associate professor at the University of Oklahoma studying global warming, after his testimony to the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee unless Deming would state that global warming was being caused by man?

Now, let's move on to a statement made by Neal Boortz on February 06, 2007:
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Chicago is going through its coldest stretch of weather in 11 years.  That's "coldest."  Must be the global warming, right?

That's awesome.  Chicago is at its coldest in 11 years.  I guess Global Warming must exist.  Maybe next we should start believing the world is flat again.

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Al Gore says that the Bush Administration is paying scientists to dispute the party line on man-made global warming. Now isn't it odd that Gore doesn't mention that many of the scientists who are preaching the party line are being paid to do so! These scientists know that as soon as they get off the man-made global warming bandwagon their funding dries up. I guess this just slipped Gore's mind.

Now that's interesting.  Most scientists, if not all, currently dispise the Bush Administration.  Evidence is shown by a recent article in Popular Science magazine (I believe this month's issue).  

From another news report, this one on February 9th:
Code: [Select]
Parts of the Northeast United States have been nailed by six to seven feet of snow. No ... that's not six to seven inches, we're talking six to seven feet! For those of you educated in government schools, that would be from 72 to 84 inches. They're expecting another two feet perhaps by the end of the day. Why? Well ... global warming, of course! What else would cause record snowfalls other than global warming?
Oh, and if that wasn't enough for you, then here's some more:
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One city in upstate New York, Redfield, has accumulated 146 inches of snow in the latest winter storm to roar through. Another major winter storm is on the way .... more snow, more cold weather ... and this one is headed to Chicago. Chicago will pick up a foot or more of snow in the next day or two. . Below Chicago into the Mississippi Valley they're looking at another ice storm on the way. I don't know about you ... but a few more weeks of these cold temperatures and 100-inch snows and I'm going to really be fed up with this global warming.

Considering America is supposed to have the highest CO2 emmissions, doesn't that mean we're supposed to be the hottest?

Not to mention the fact that recently, decisions were made in Canada that are rejecting the goals put forth to them by the Kyoto accords.  I can not remember exactly where I read this, but I know it was published by The Associated Press.  CO2 emissions in Canada have risen by 26% since 1997, and they were supposed to have fallen by like 5% or something by 2010 or 2012, can't remember which.

News report from February 14th:

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A congressional committee was scheduled to hold a hearing today entitled "Climate Change: Are Greenhouse Gas Emissions from Human Activities Contributing to a Warming of the Planet?" That hearing has now been cancelled. A new date will be announced later. Seems that it's too cold in Washington today. There's almost an inch of ice on the roads and sleet is falling. Don't you just hate it when an global warming alarmist hearing is cancelled because its too cold? Poor babies.


Oh, and I guess the "inventor of the internet" doesn't make enough money and doesn't use his liberal (really, it's socialistic) propaganda enough.  He's now having a concert as a new way to spread "global warming"  Interesting.  Using a scientific matter through political means.  That's very interesting.  More at http://http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/14/AR2007021401629.html

Now, when Kyrie mentions those statistics about "650,000 years".  What about before then?  Tell me that.  I can tell you right now that Dinosaurs weren't around that short of a time ago, were they?  I can probably bet that, most dinosaurs being reptiles (cold blooded), the global temperature was MUCH higher back then.

Global warming is a bunch of propaganda.  Now, I'm not saying I don't support things like Hybrids or emissions control, because I love the semi-clean air I breath here in Colorado, but global warming is just a bunch of bullmalarkey.  They only show you the negative things, which as far as I'm concerned is information manipulation.

Oh, and does anyone want to mention rising sea levels?  Because I know Gore does.  What he fails to mention is that the sea levels have been rising for 12,000 years and reports indicate that they have risen about 300ft in that time.

Now, even IF global warming did exist, how is things like closing down factories and getting rid of cars going to fix it?  The real problem would be that humans are breathing and are causing carbon dioxide levels to rise.  Only way to fix that is to leave the planet or kill all humans.  Good job!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by RedneckNoob »





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plasma

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« Reply #28 on: February 16, 2007 07:09 pm CST »
Can you say you actually think that we are not hurting our environment?  In 2003 the world oil demand was 80,000,000 barrels per day.  Of course not all of it is used for transportation purposes, but say even 30% of it is, where do you think all the exhaust smoke is going?  It's gotta go somewhere man it doesn't just disappear.  

Why is marijuana illegal when there is no longevity of our race in the first place?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by plasma »

RedneckNoob

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« Reply #29 on: February 16, 2007 07:50 pm CST »
I never mentioned one thing about not "harming the environment".  I just that the global temperature "increasing" is bullmalarkey.  Also,  I would make it illegal because it's a way for people to delude their perceptions letting them hide from the truth.  I find hiding from the truth to be a horrible thing.  The feelings you get from it can be no good considering they mess up your ability to think.  But that's besides the point.  I also think we need to stay away from the marijuana topic because we already opened one can of worms, we don't want another.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 06:00 pm CST by RedneckNoob »





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Das Weib war der zweite Fehlgriff Gottes.  -Friedrich Nietzsche