The Great Server Clear Debate of 2008

[Particle]

It has only been half a year or a year since I last proposed this, but the situation has changed significantly.  Player counts are down, and while this isn't the first time we've had a lull it might be a good time to clear should we collectively want one.  Might.  Clearing can drive away the top-remort characters potentially.  It can also bring in new players and old players that don't feel they have a chance anymore.

So, what are your opinions on the subject?  I'm not making a simple poll on this one.  You must post here with a few sentences describing your opinion and if you do or do not feel a clear is warranted if you wish to vote.

Bring in your TRPG friends on this one.  I'm interested to know what the players feel would be best.

This discussion will close on December 1, 2008 and I will make a decision based on the input.

[Adam6]

I'd love to see the server back up with more than 2 AFK people, and Tokath.

But, to clear the server. You'd need some sort of new content. Maybe, some new zones, new secrets, and a new weapon.

I'd ACTUALLY play instead of just AFK like I am now.

You would also need some sort of way to recruit Newbies into playing Tribes.

Perhaps a Youtube Video on how to set up Tribes RPG.

If you'd do this, (In my opinion) people would see this video, looking for a decent, fun, MMORPG and go download it and try it out.

Since the server has been cleared, there will not be anyone 1000 Rl's higher to drive them out.

I think you SHOULD clear.

[12Stones]

I actually have a set goal that I am looking to attain. Then I will stop rling my main character and move on to my secondary one.

My vote is a resounding NO.

I understand what you are saying, but isn't AFK leveling to a specific RL just so you can play an alternate character a little pointless?  I guess if it brings you entertainment in some strange way, I can't really speak, but I don't understand how being able to take down anything in the game at level 1 would bring anyone pleasure for more than an hour.  Doesn't it get boring when no bot OR player in the game can even hurt you?

As far as "players trickling back in" and "a decent amount of players", I'd have to disagree there..  recently the only person I see playing is tokath, and woops..  that's just a bot!  I think players are getting along because there are never more than 2 non-afk players on at a time..  haha.

I think the reason why other servers are more populated now (rather than Particles being the popular one) is because the players are much more even in level and they are able to interact with eachother.  If someone were to start playing on particles right now, they would be restricted to playing alone with little to no PvP/Player interaction until way after they reached god status.  This brings me to another point which someone already mentioned.  I think the key to success of any future clear on PCRPG would be the addition of new content to go along with it.

Particle, is there any way you could post some sort of graph or information on server activity over the past few months?

[-ShaNNaRa-]

People play other servers because there is new content being added in on a consistent basis.

A clear without severely revamping the current mod will be pointless and won't help out the player count in any way.

[Corona]

I have historically been against clears. I was adamantly against the most recent clear, and for the longest time I've been against clearing the current server.

But, now, I'm not so sure. This post made me think:

I'd love to see the server back up with more than 2 AFK people, and Tokath.

But, to clear the server. You'd need some sort of new content. Maybe, some new zones, new secrets, and a new weapon.

I'd ACTUALLY play instead of just AFK like I am now.

You would also need some sort of way to recruit Newbies into playing Tribes.

Perhaps a Youtube Video on how to set up Tribes RPG.

If you'd do this, (In my opinion) people would see this video, looking for a decent, fun, MMORPG and go download it and try it out.

Since the server has been cleared, there will not be anyone 1000 Rl's higher to drive them out.

I think you SHOULD clear.

However....

A clear without severely revamping the current mod will be pointless and won't help out the player count in any way.

[Celtic16]

I vote yes!

[Celtic16]

clear the server,, get more players, Don't clear the server, make the only player happy.....evil_stink!

[Celtic16]

it's a platform to say what I feel about the subject, you're the only on in the server at the minute.

Make an anon that the server will be cleared in 7 days and you'll have a tonne of new players!!!

[12Stones]

Clone accounts of one person does not constitute a "ton of players". The only result a clear can have is less players and less players wanting to join because they would see that there would be no point as all they work for and show dedication to the server would go for nought as it was just turned around and taken from them. That alone would chase away any would be players.
Now new content added to a server of members who are willing to help them learn the ropes along with the knowledge that they will get to "keep" what they earn and work towards rather then have it wisked away at a whim. THAT would get new players coming.

the server hasn't been cleared in what..  a couple years?  i seriously doubt tribes will be alive in a couple years, and if it is, i'm willing to bet my left testicle that there won't be any populated RPG servers up.  the only reason YOU think that people wouldn't join if there was a clear is because you don't want one..  who are you to tell us what people will think?  personally, i'm not playing nor will i play if the server isn't cleared..  that's just my opinion.  if i was the only person who felt this way, i wouldn't want the server cleared.

be honest..  when is the last time you came even remotely close to dying on your main character?  when is the last time you even lost 1/4 of your HP?

i understand that you don't want to lose all the time you spent AFK leveling, but for you to say that a clear would discourage new people (or oldbies who have quit) from playing is silly.  that's merely how YOU would feel in that situation.  if there is another clear, it will undoubtedly be the last one.

[Particle]

Tribes isn't gaining any momentum to be sure.  The problem with player count isn't just my server.  When I look around, I only see a few people playing TRPG at all most of the time (if I don't count bots).  Despite Tribes losing its player base, we've always been pretty strong regardless.  But to be honest to the times, it's obvious that there just aren't as many new players coming in as there used to be.  The TRPG download is hosted on my domain as many of you know, so I am able to track download counts.  In the last 10 days, we've had 35 hits for the TRPG installer.  Of those, 4 were resume requests. From my website directly (not linked from the planettribes TRPG site), we've had 22 downloads.  Some portion of these downloads never manifest themselves as new players for whatever reason.  The high number of hits from my site is unlikely to come from newbies.  More likely, we're seeing a lot of players re-downloading this who have played before.  The number of hits I get from Google from search terms like "pcrpg" or "Particle's RPG" seem to confirm that people already know what they're looking for.  These aren't random encounters (newbies).  While this is encouraging for a community rebuild, it isn't necessarily a good thing in the long run for newbie flow.  The raw fact of the matter is that we're in a declining community, but for the time being I'd like to make the best of the returning member re-surge.

As a focus of direction here, remember that I'm just hosting so that people have a place to play.  I have historically offered one of the least laggy servers with the highest player count on the best hardware and with a good staff.  I'd like to think that's the main reason why we have had such a rich patronage.  Ever since the master servers bit it though, our newbie flow went *poof*.  It wasn't entirely the remort gap problem or the problematic player problem.  If I had to point at any one thing, it would be the master server termination.  If I had to point at any two things, I'd point at the MS and new Vista machines.  If I could point at any three things, I'd include the declining interest in Tribes.  Given four, I'd include problematic players.  That's how I've perceived it anyway.

Anyway, I currently think a clear would do more good in the way of drawing in people who got bored than harm.  We could even do a split for the sake of the newbies (if there are any), where anyone under RL3 or so keeps their stats.

As for new content, I'd love to see it.  Every time I give someone a green light to do it though, nothing ever happens.  They lose interest, forget, or can't do what they said they'd do.  People, I'm open to new content.  It isn't going to come from me though.  We need people who are willing to develop new stuff.  I'll just glue it together, give it a home, and run it.  I've got a full time job, and I haven't had the necessary creative urges for that kind of stuff (not that I'm artistic at all) since I was like 15.





I am starting to miss you guys though.  I disappeared for much of college, but I want to get us back to the fun community we once had.  And let's be honest, it wasn't just about PCRPG.  We liked talking to each other and hearing from each other on IRC, in-game, and on this forum.  It's that community aspect I want back most of all.  The game is just how we all met.  

[Vorter_X_]

<--Vista
<--No job
<--No guaranteed internet access

Vista has not stopped me from attempting to recreate an RPG map in it's entirety...In fact just the opposite occurred, I do not have a complete map or anything that I would consider playable right now, but the idea is that I have been consistently using the Tribes base to be creative and create worlds...That technically I have used in D&D with my friends just to irritate them.

Given the opportunity to come back to a revamped server, I would indeed. Some specific changes would need to happen...This remort system is utter bullmalarkey...It has been from the start, it needs to go. I think it wouldn't be entirely impossible or hard even to completely redo the mod and make it better and possibly it's own game. (That sound familiar? Source?)

The first clear is the only reason I stopped playing in the first place. Yeah it sucked, and yeah it probably wasn't even 1/1000th the level of this one will be. In fact prior to that one, everyone had fun. There were always people fighting for the last spot in the server, always. I'm not up for an argument, so don't flame me.

Essentially the same base of people from....oh.....6-8 years ago...still access the internet on a consistent basis, I've had the same friends list for longer than that. So it would not be hard to get the word out about a change. Quite a bit of stuff needs to be eliminated out of the mod or recreated slightly differently, so that people don't get bored with doing the same thing over and over again. The rules for the server should be cleared and rewritten more simply and with a couple differences, like afking...AFK = A free kill...Also a boot from the server. It's not so common that that would happen now because the server has enough open slots to accommodate the afker's and the few people who play. With a full server, an afk slot can be emptied and a person (child) who might have limited time on the internet during the day could get on, therein luring more people to the server.

Done rambling, I've got more, but I've been trying to focus on getting a job.

[Jonathan]

I just signed up on the forumns, but I have been playing pcrpg for a long time and I think a clear would actually be a good thing for the server. I have a level 740 something 200 remort named PBDeath666 and another rl 90 something named Jonathan, but people are hardly on anymore and this gives me little reason to get on as well. As others have said it gets boring not being able to get hurt by any bot. Players are what made pcrpg fun and I wouldn't mind giving up my old characters if more people played, which I know more people would if there were a clear. I can't help with adding new weapons or changes to the mod itself, but if I could get a copy of the map and mod to work with I'm sure I could make new buildings for all the zones and move them around and whatnot. Anyways that's my two cents. It's just sad to see tokath in the server alone most of the time ha.

[Jonathan]

There's no reason the old players would likely be forced off the servers as you say and if they enjoyed making a power character then they should enjoy making a new character when there are actually other players close to their level and hp to level with. You don't see high level characters making new characters and leveling because it's no fun when there are no other players around their remort level. The higher level bots have been asked for, but you don't seem to understand that someone has to actually do that work and unless someone agrees to do it it's not going to happen. Talk of a clear keeping new characters from wanting to level before the clear makes sense. It also makes sense that they would come to the server knowing the clear is done with. The server is really lacking players and the way I see it it's going to hurt the community more long term if there is not a clear.

[Jonathan]

The thing is all those games actually work for their levels. Tribes rpg has remorting built in because there really is a shortage of content. The main bots are hardly enough to keep even a remort lvl 100 busy. The game is just not built for huge remort levels and yet it's always these characters who don't want to actually play the game again. Being a remort lvl 1000 is pretty much just playing a game with constant exploits. Sitting around waiting for someone to make better bots for your level character is the real joke here. And don't even complain about worrying about constant clearing. Do you even have any idea how long it has been since the last clear! Just look at some the remort levels people got to in that time. We had multiple people with over one or two thousand remorts. New players would come if we put together a new map and any other content people can make, but to me it doesn't seem like the old characters should already be huge levels on the new map as it would kind've ruin the whole point of making one. If you want better bots you are either going to have to do them yourself or find someone to do them. Sitting around and waiting for someone to come forward has proven not to work. Player counts in the server are extremely low and clear or no clear new content would be a good thing, but keep in mind theorizing about it is one thing and actually seeing that it is done (this century) is another.

[Particle]

There's a lot here to consider.  In any case (clear or no clear), we need to refresh the content.  I'm not entirely opposed to redoing the mod entire in Tribes.  Redoing it in another game becomes more difficult.  I've been playing around with modding the Source engine since by now everyone and their mother has HL2, but it isn't as mod friendly.  The biggest problem is that it doesn't even compile.  lol

I need some real talent in the way of mappers, modelers, and skinners.