Tribes 2 is back!

[Dyre]

Holy crap, really?  I wasn't aware of that.  I guess if TRPG's issues were that limited with such a low count, we should be fine in Tribes 2...

Then again, we might be misunderstanding each other...  Isn't the 255 item limit the limit on different items allowed in the game, I.E. different weapons and armor types?  The limit I'm talking about in T2 are actual map objects, such as the terrain block, the players, vehicles, buildings, base assets, etc..  For example, on the construction mod servers, the object count would be reached constantly from the stuff players deployed all the time.  Multiple instances of the same object count as well.

edit:

http://www.mypicx.com/02112009/Tribesrpg_1rst_Model_in_gme/

Nifty.

[KoRo]

It's only 1024?  Well, that's still leaps better than 255 like in Tribes.

The 1024 item limit was a constant nuisance in the Construction Mod, so if T2RPG is going to be as big (and as detailed) as we'd like, I think we'll have to seriously consider that 1024 limit.

As for prefabbing...I honestly haven't had much practice with it, so I can't say for certain.

[Particle]

Ok, yeah, the 255 limit was for ItemDatas (kinds of different items).  We can get pretty creative if we have to with prefabs, making cities just one big block instead of pieces.  The only issue we'll probably run into is with detail items like trees and bushes.  Even so, I think we'll be OK with 1024 so long as we're smart about collecting the trash.  It's too bad though.  And here I was all excited about making the world persistent with dropped items and such.

[WiiMote]

I'm curious if it would be possible to trick T2 in some fashion for some objects...  Like k-mines for example.  The mines use multiple blocks to be created, is it feasible to make a script so the server combines those blocks into one "object" when the map is started?  Of course, the server would need a way to send the proper information to the client so the client can do it as well.

I could see "some" persistance, but with obvious limitations and checks in place.

[KoRo]

Part, you may not be entirely out of luck. One of the versions of Construction Mod, called Structural Infinity, extends the visual piece limit to at least 10,000.
Screenshots: http://www.the-construct.net/forums/showthread.php?t=427

Supposedly, it takes a little client side modding, but considering that T2RPG is a client-side mod anyway, I would imagine that it is entirely possible to extend the piece limit for T2RPG purposes. Unfortunately, I don't have the slightest idea how, or where to even begin looking.

[Dyre]

TribesNext actually currently does not support that.  It's already been mentioned over in their forums.  I thought about bringing it up, but it seemed kinda pointless because I don't know if support is supposed to be added in the future.

[KoRo]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that part. No, TribesNext does not support it YET. The devs for Construction mod are working on it, though. I wouldn't be surprised if the fixed it within the next few months.

[Particle]

We may still end up being okay.  I could kind of fake it and kill off objects not within x meters of anyone and respawn them when there is someone there.  It doesn't promise that we'll never have an issue, but if I try to manage a few hundred dropped things dynamically like that it might help.

[Lidge Farkley]

What happens when the item limit is reached?
Crash?
No new item shows up?
I am guessing some resourceful item spammers could still drop enough instances of items to screw things up...
...but maybe that is part of the problem of the engines to begin with... limited instances of things.

[KoRo]

As far as Tribes 2 goes, once the item limit is reached, things will simply stop showing up. If you try to place anything, the game will play as though you dropped an item, but you won't be able to see it. At least, that's how it is in Construction.

Part, I'd like to give a shot at prefabbing. Is there anything different about it compared to regular 3D modeling? (Aside from exporting the prefab). Any regulations I should be aware of? Specific program to use? Polycount?

[Lidge Farkley]

Hm... I seem to remember these rough guidelines from Tee One:
1st person of weapons: 30-60 polygons
3rd person of weapons (what some one sees when they look at you): 15 polygons
Buildings: Lower is better.  Don't remember exacts.
Google reveals this odd bit:  http://www.tribaloutpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2212
This was also revealed and seems more accurate:  http://pc.ign.com/articles/073/073843p1.html
Remember the engine and hardware differences involved, though.

Here's the part from the interview:

Dynamix: Could you describe the differences between the models in TRIBES 2 and the ones in TRIBES?

BD: Much higher poly count, for starters. TRIBES models ran about 350 to 400 polygons each, but we're up to 1,500 to 1,600 with TRIBES 2, so you can see that when we say "low poly count," it's relative to what we could do with the new engine. And there's additional texture resolution, stuff that makes Gerald's eye candy possible. Got to give it up for Character Studio 2. Their human animation system, 3D MAX, is just HUGE.

GH: Yeah. It lets you fine-tune the motion capture and attach motion to the models.

TM: We helped beta-test Character Studio 2, and some of the stuff we worked on really helped us. We were really locked down on what we could do with TRIBES.

So... it looks like 1500 is a good goal.

[rjm003]

The models they are talking about are player and weapon models. 1500 Poly's would be a low detailed shape, maybe for a small 1 room tower. For something like a castle you would be in the 5,000 - 10,000 range, and its easy to go more than that. Remember there is also LOD (level of detail) settings for shapes. Also, Most people have rigs nowdays that can handle a lot more than what the average person could when T1 and even T2 came out.

[Particle]

Those poly counts are probably specific to player models.  I'd think weapon models are probably in the 300-400 range for V models and half of that for W models.  Probably the easiest thing to do would be to start somewhere--let's make a sword with say 400ish polys and see how the engine handles it.  As for prefabbing, it's pretty straight forward.  I'm not sure what Tribes 2 uses for it, but in all games where I've worked with mapping (prefabbing in Tribes), it has always been straight forward:  Make some geometry and then texture it.

The item spamming thing wouldn't be an issue.  I'd be using a LIFO structure as far as spawned items, meaning that the oldest items disappear first and would do so automatically when there are x actively spawned items and a new one is dropped.  It gives us a hybrid between best case and practical, allowing us to have the most number of items spawned as possible without getting rid of stuff when not needed (just using a timer).

[Jonathan]

I would really like to see this mod finished and I might be able to help with the prefabs if making them is anything like making maps with worldcraft. I downloaded tribes next, but I can never get online because it always says the server that you need to generate an account is offline. When does this come online does anyone know? Or does anyone have an account I can log onto? Anyways I will mess around in my server and post any anomalies I come across.

[KoRo]

The TribesNext master server should always be up. Contact the guys at tribesnext.com if you're having problems though. I don't know why you wouldn't be able to see it unless you have port 28000 blocked.